24 posts tagged “bible”
Biblical scholars have long realized that the flood myth in the Bible is compilation of two older but parallel stories, one from the northern kingdom of Israel (called the E source) and the other from the southern kingdom of Judah (called the J source). These stories were combined by some priestly group (the P source) in Jerusalem after the northern kingdom was destroyed by Assyria in 720 BC. The influx of northern refugees into the south required that a new common history be created by merging the slightly different traditions of their common religion. The editorial P source was very concerned with an orderly history which explains its emphasis on genealogy and the covenant theology which gives a framework in which to understand Israel's history (both is triumphs and defeats). A review of a book that attempts to recreate the J source can be found here. What follows is my attempt at separating the two parallel sources.
Rationale for the Flood
J source
6:5 The LORD saw how great man's wickedness on the earth had become, and that every inclination of the thoughts of his heart was only evil all the time. 6 The LORD was grieved that he had made man on the earth, and his heart was filled with pain. 7 So the LORD said, "I will wipe mankind, whom I have created, from the face of the earth—men and animals, and creatures that move along the ground, and birds of the air—for I am grieved that I have made them." 8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD.
P source editorial introduction
9 This is the account of Noah. Noah was a righteous man, blameless among the people of his time, and he walked with God. 10 Noah had three sons: Shem, Ham and Japheth.
E source
11 Now the earth was corrupt in God's sight and was full of violence. 12 God saw how corrupt the earth had become, for all the people on earth had corrupted their ways. 13 So God said to Noah, "I am going to put an end to all people, for the earth is filled with violence because of them. I am surely going to destroy both them and the earth.
Comments
In this New International Version of the Bible "LORD" is a translation of the Hebrew word "Yahweh" while God is a translation of the Hebrew word "Elohim". These two different terms for the divinity are the primary characteristics of their respective sources.
Construction Commands
E source
13 So God said to Noah, "I am going to put an end to all people, for the earth is filled with violence because of them. I am surely going to destroy both them and the earth. 14 So make yourself an ark of cypress wood; make rooms in it and coat it with pitch inside and out. 15 This is how you are to build it: The ark is to be 450 feet long, 75 feet wide and 45 feet high. 16 Make a roof for it and finish the ark to within 18 inches of the top. Put a door in the side of the ark and make lower, middle and upper decks. 17 I am going to bring floodwaters on the earth to destroy all life under the heavens, every creature that has the breath of life in it. Everything on earth will perish. 18 But I will establish my covenant with you, and you will enter the ark (P editor insert) —you and your sons and your wife and your sons' wives with you. 19 You are to bring into the ark two of all living creatures, male and female, to keep them alive with you. 20 Two of every kind of bird, of every kind of animal and of every kind of creature that moves along the ground will come to you to be kept alive. 21 You are to take every kind of food that is to be eaten and store it away as food for you and for them."
22 Noah did everything just as God commanded him.
J Source
7:1 The LORD then said to Noah, "Go into the ark, you and your whole family, because I have found you righteous in this generation. 2 Take with you seven of every kind of clean animal, a male and its mate, and two of every kind of unclean animal, a male and its mate, 3 and also seven of every kind of bird, male and female, to keep their various kinds alive throughout the earth. 4 Seven days from now I will send rain on the earth for forty days and forty nights, and I will wipe from the face of the earth every living creature I have made."
5 And Noah did all that the LORD commanded him.
Comments
Verse 15 in Hebrew is: 300 cubits long, 50 cubits wide and 30 cubits high (about 140 meters long, 23 meters wide and 13.5 meters high).
Notice the difference between the sources in the number and type of animals that Noah was to bring onto the ark.
Entering the Ark
E Source
6 Noah was six hundred years old when the floodwaters came on the earth. 7 And Noah and his sons and his wife and his sons' wives entered the ark to escape the waters of the flood. 8 Pairs of clean and unclean animals, of birds and of all creatures that move along the ground, 9 male and female, came to Noah and entered the ark, as God had commanded Noah. 10 And after the seven days the floodwaters came on the earth.
J Source
11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, on the seventeenth day of the second month—on that day all the springs of the great deep burst forth, and the floodgates of the heavens were opened. 12 And rain fell on the earth forty days and forty nights.
P Source adds this editorial summary
13 On that very day Noah and his sons, Shem, Ham and Japheth, together with his wife and the wives of his three sons, entered the ark. 14 They had with them every wild animal according to its kind, all livestock according to their kinds, every creature that moves along the ground according to its kind and every bird according to its kind, everything with wings. 15 Pairs of all creatures that have the breath of life in them came to Noah and entered the ark. 16 The animals going in were male and female of every living thing, as God had commanded Noah. Then the LORD shut him in.
The Flood Begins
J Source
17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth.
E source
18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than twenty feet. 21 Every living thing that moved on the earth perished—birds, livestock, wild animals, all the creatures that swarm over the earth, and all mankind. 22 Everything on dry land that had the breath of life in its nostrils died. 23 Every living thing on the face of the earth was wiped out; men and animals and the creatures that move along the ground and the birds of the air were wiped from the earth. Only Noah was left, and those with him in the ark. 24 The waters flooded the earth for a hundred and fifty days.
The Flood Ends
E source
8:1 But God remembered Noah and all the wild animals and the livestock that were with him in the ark, and he sent a wind over the earth, and the waters receded. 2 Now the springs of the deep and the floodgates of the heavens had been closed, and the rain had stopped falling from the sky. 3 The water receded steadily from the earth. At the end of the hundred and fifty days the water had gone down, 4 and on the seventeenth day of the seventh month the ark came to rest on the mountains of Ararat. 5 The waters continued to recede until the tenth month, and on the first day of the tenth month the tops of the mountains became visible.
J Source
6 After forty days Noah opened the window he had made in the ark 7 and sent out a raven, and it kept flying back and forth until the water had dried up from the earth. 8 Then he sent out a dove to see if the water had receded from the surface of the ground. 9 But the dove could find no place to set its feet because there was water over all the surface of the earth; so it returned to Noah in the ark. He reached out his hand and took the dove and brought it back to himself in the ark. 10 He waited seven more days and again sent out the dove from the ark. 11 When the dove returned to him in the evening, there in its beak was a freshly plucked olive leaf! Then Noah knew that the water had receded from the earth. 12 He waited seven more days and sent the dove out again, but this time it did not return to him. 13 By the first day of the first month of Noah's six hundred and first year, the water had dried up from the earth. Noah then removed the covering from the ark and saw that the surface of the ground was dry. 14 By the twenty-seventh day of the second month the earth was completely dry.
Comments
Notice that the drying of the earth took much longer in the E source (more than 10 months) than in the J source (two months). Apparently the rest of the E source flood ending was deleted since it does not go all the way to the dry land stage.
Out of the Ark
E Source
15 Then God said to Noah, 16 "Come out of the ark, you and your wife and your sons and their wives. 17 Bring out every kind of living creature that is with you—the birds, the animals, and all the creatures that move along the ground—so they can multiply on the earth and be fruitful and increase in number upon it."
18 So Noah came out, together with his sons and his wife and his sons' wives. 19 All the animals and all the creatures that move along the ground and all the birds—everything that moves on the earth—came out of the ark, one kind after another.
J Source
20 Then Noah built an altar to the LORD and, taking some of all the clean animals and clean birds, he sacrificed burnt offerings on it. 21 The LORD smelled the pleasing aroma and said in his heart: "Never again will I curse the ground because of man, even though every inclination of his heart is evil from childhood. And never again will I destroy all living creatures, as I have done.
22 "As long as the earth endures,
seedtime and harvest,
cold and heat,
summer and winter,
day and night
will never cease."
Final Comment
Notice how well the story line of each source flow together, a flow that is lost in the combined version.
Also notice that this flood myth is not based on a raging river flood analogy. Instead the extra water came from a combination of springs and rain that smoothly rose.
Some recent news from archeology seems to confirm to the historical accuracy of the book of Jeremiah. The full article can be found in the latest issue of Archeology.
The full 39th chapter of Jeremiah can be found here.Austrian Assyriologist Michael Jursa recently discovered the financial record of a donation made a Babylonian chief official, Nebo-Sarsekim. The find may lend new credibility to the Book of Jeremiah, which cites Nebo-Sarsekim as a participant in the siege of Jerusalem in 587 B.C.
The tablet is dated to 595 B.C., which was during the reign of the Babylonian king, Nebuchadnezzar II. Coming to the throne in 604 B.C., he marched to Egypt shortly thereafter, and initiated an epoch of fighting between the two nations. During the ongoing struggle, Jerusalem was captured in 597, and again in 587-6 B.C. It was at this second siege that Nebo-Sarsekim made his appearance.
He ordered Nebo-Sarsekim to look after Jeremiah: "Take him, and look well to him, and do him no harm; but do unto him even as he shall say unto thee." (Jeremiah 39.12)
As the biblical story goes, the victorious Babylonian king departed the city with numerous Jewish captives. Desiring to spare the prophet Jeremiah, he ordered Nebo-Sarsekim to look after him: "Take him, and look well to him, and do him no harm; but do unto him even as he shall say unto thee." (Jeremiah 39.12). Nebo-Sarsekim obeyed these orders by taking Jeremiah out of the Babylonian court of the prison, and ensuring he was escorted home to Jerusalem to live among his people.
Since the Bible group has become invested with topics far distant from the Bible I have formed my own group which will be tightly moderated. Its focus is on Biblical Scholarship meaning the discussion must be related to how the Bible came to be and what the passages really mean. It can be found here.
This is the third in a series of posts regarding the existence of a real historical person named Jesus. The other posts can be found under the tag Historical Jesus.
The earliest written Christian documents are the letters of the Apostle Paul. Not all letters attributed to him can be considered actually written by him. The ones scholars considered authentic with a high degree of probability are 1 Thessalonians, Romans, 1 and 2 Corinthians, Galatians, Philippians, and Philemon. These letters stand or fall together based upon their common style.
Evidence That These Letters Are Authentic and Early
Romans Chapter 1
This passage is evidence for an early date for Paul's letters. It describes a very early interpretation of the relationship of Jesus to God. Here Jesus is declared to be a legal Son of God by his resurrection, not at his baptism as in Mark. Neither was he born that way as described in the birth stories of Matthew and Luke. Neither was he the pre-existant Word of John 1:1. This would not be the theology described in these letters if they were forged by a later Christianity. It also connects this person Jesus with being the Christ and humanities Lord in Pauline theology.2 the gospel he promised beforehand through his prophets in the Holy Scriptures 3 regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David, 4 and who through the Spirit of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God by his resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord
Romans Chapter 16
The whole chapter shows an early Christian community without a male dominated hierarchy. Men and women are equally represented as travelers spreading the Christian message. This is just the most concentrated example of this early state of Christianity for it can be found in most of Paul's letters. Paul also often warns against such travelers having "false" messages. Again this type of Christianity would not be described if these letters were later forgeries.
1 Corinthians Chapter 16
This indicates Jerusalem had not yet been destroyed or come under siege from the First Jewish-Roman War. This war started in A.D. 66. Jerusalem was destroyed in A.D 70.1 Now about the collection for God's people: Do what I told the Galatian churches to do. 2 On the first day of every week, each one of you should set aside a sum of money in keeping with his income, saving it up, so that when I come no collections will have to be made. 3 Then, when I arrive, I will give letters of introduction to the men you approve and send them with your gift to Jerusalem. 4 If it seems advisable for me to go also, they will accompany me.
1 Corinthians Chapter 9
1 Am I not free? Am I not an apostle? Have I not seen Jesus our Lord? Are you not the result of my work in the Lord? 2 Even though I may not be an apostle to others, surely I am to you! For you are the seal of my apostleship in the Lord. 3 This is my defense to those who sit in judgment on me. 4 Don't we have the right to food and drink? 5 Don't we have the right to take a believing wife along with us, as do the other apostles and the Lord's brothers and Cephas? 6 Or is it only I and Barnabas who must work for a living?
1 Corinthians Chapter 15
3 For what I received I passed on to you as of first importance: that Christ died for our sins according to the Scriptures, 4 that he was buried, that he was raised on the third day according to the Scriptures, 5 and that he appeared to Peter, and then to the Twelve. 6 After that, he appeared to more than five hundred of the brothers at the same time, most of whom are still living, though some have fallen asleep. 7 Then he appeared to James, then to all the apostles, 8 and last of all he appeared to me also, as to one abnormally born. 9 For I am the least of the apostles and do not even deserve to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.
Paul seems to have always been self conscious of the fact that he was a late comer to Christianity and thus one having lessor authority than the disciples and earlier followers. Paul sees no difference between his vision of Jesus on the way to Damascus with the other reported after-death sightings of Jesus.This passage mentions that the apostles (Cephus is the Greek term for Peter) had wives, something not found in later Christianity. This again points to the early state of Christianity in Paul's letters shows and how unlikely this letter is to be a later forgery. The term "brothers" as used here probably is probably an early term for members of the Christian community.
Galatians Chapter 2
11 When Peter came to Antioch, I opposed him to his face, because he was clearly in the wrong. 12 Before certain men came from James, he used to eat with the Gentiles. But when they arrived, he began to draw back and separate himself from the Gentiles because he was afraid of those who belonged to the circumcision group. 13 The other Jews joined him in his hypocrisy, so that by their hypocrisy even Barnabas was led astray.
14 When I saw that they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter in front of them all, "You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew. How is it, then, that you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs?
A division within the early Christian community is not something a later forger would think to put in, especially one that implies Gentiles were second class citizens.
Evidence for a Real Historical Jesus in the Letters
1 Corinthians Chapter 7
25 Now about virgins: I have no command from the Lord, but I give a judgment as one who by the Lord's mercy is trustworthy. 26 Because of the present crisis, I think that it is good for you to remain as you are. 27 Are you married? Do not seek a divorce. Are you unmarried? Do not look for a wife. 28 But if you do marry, you have not sinned; and if a virgin marries, she has not sinned. But those who marry will face many troubles in this life, and I want to spare you this. 29 What I mean, brothers, is that the time is short. From now on those who have wives should live as if they had none; 30 those who mourn, as if they did not; those who are happy, as if they were not; those who buy something, as if it were not theirs to keep; 31 those who use the things of the world, as if not engrossed in them. For this world in its present form is passing away.
Two things here. The first is that Paul is referring to Jesus (the Lord) as a real person, the one who is the authority behind his moral teachings.
The second point is that Paul's expectation that the apocalyptic Kingdom of
God would arrive so soon that people should not get married is an
embarrassment. He was wrong, the Kingdom of God did not arrive within
his generation. This sort of passage would never be inserted by a later
Christian forger.
Galatians Chapter 1 and 2
Another mention of an intact Jerusalem with the fact that James (died A.D. 62 according to Josephus), the brother of Jesus, was living there along with Peter. This indicates Jesus was a real human being having a brother. This passage also indicates that Christianity had not yet spread very far away from Israel. James is not mentioned explicitly as being in Jerusalem 14 years later but the war had not yet started meaning that a Christian community was in Jerusalem by A.D 52 (66 - 14).18 Then after three years, I went up to Jerusalem to get acquainted with Peter and stayed with him fifteen days. 19 I saw none of the other apostles—only James, the Lord's brother. 20 I assure you before God that what I am writing you is no lie. 21 Later I went to Syria and Cilicia. 22I was personally unknown to the churches of Judea that are in Christ. 23 They only heard the report: "The man who formerly persecuted us is now preaching the faith he once tried to destroy." 24 And they praised God because of me.
2:1Fourteen years later I went up again to Jerusalem, this time with Barnabas. I took Titus along also. 2 I went in response to a revelation and set before them the gospel that I preach among the Gentiles. But I did this privately to those who seemed to be leaders, for fear that I was running or had run my race in vain.
This series of posts was inspired by by Draconem's post here.
Three lines of evidence point to the existence of Jesus as a real historical person: Novel Ideology in the sense that some new ideology was created that did not exist anywhere before, Early Non-Christian Sources primarily being Josephus and Tacitus, and Early Christian Sources primarily from the letters of Paul and the early oral tradition found in the gospels. This post discusses the Novel Ideology line of evidence.
Edit: For the other two lines of evidence see the tag Historical Jesus.
Two separate Roman era traditions claim a person named Jesus as their source, Orthodox Christianity and Gnostic Christianity. Their common element is their concern about a coming Kingdom of God. They differ on how it comes about. Orthodox Christianity holds the Kingdom of God will come about in a final apocalyptic Day of Judgment with Jesus as the messiah in conformance with the whole Jewish apocalyptic movement that seems to have originated with the book of Daniel (which in turn was based upon ideas expressed by earlier prophets about the restoration of Israel and Judah after their destruction by Assyrian and Babylon). Gnostic Christianity holds that the Kingdom of God is already here only that people do not see it because they do not have the required knowledge or gnosis. Because of this Gnostic Christianity drifted towards the mystic traditions.
So we have two widely divergent traditions that did not exist before mid Roman times both claiming this person Jesus as their source. This means Jesus does not fit into any developing myth relating to either the apocalyptic tradition or the mystic tradition but instead indicates that some real person created some new ideology that both traditions jumped on.
This new ideology was a slowly developing earthly Kingdom or God or Kingdom of Heaven which is in complete contrast to the Jewish "sudden arrival" apocalyptic ideology prevalent at the time. This also seems to be the only ideology that could lead to both Orthodox Christianity and Gnostic Christianity. For Orthodox Christianity it would take the form that while the Kingdom of Heaven can be spread on earth by the followers of Jesus its real fulfillment will only come when God imposes His rule on earth in a final apocalyptic Day of Judgment. For Gnostic Christianity it would take the form that the Kingdom of God can only be spread if the followers of Jesus gain the proper knowledge about it. This view that the way in which the Kingdom of God arrives was central the Jesus' teaching is supported by analysis of the text sources as evidenced by the Jesus 5-Source Sayings and the Jesus 4-Source Sayings. That two separate lines or reasoning support this argument give it a high probability of being true.
One can trace the reasoning behind this core teaching of Jesus. The book of Daniel predicted that the Kingdom of God would arrive after the fall of the last Hellenistic (Greek) kingdom which was Cleopatra's Egypt. If this is true then where was the Kingdom. The clue that the Kingdom was in one's heart was provided in Jeremiah chapter 31.
From Jeremiah 31:33
33 "This is the covenant I will make with the house of Israel
after that time," declares the LORD.
"I will put my law in their minds
and write it on their hearts.
I will be their God,
and they will be my people.
34 No longer will a man teach his neighbor,
or a man his brother, saying, 'Know the LORD,'
because they will all know me,
from the least of them to the greatest,"
declares the LORD.
"For I will forgive their wickedness
and will remember their sins no more."
Deuteronomy 6:4-6
5 Love the LORD your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength. 6 These commandments that I give you today are to be upon your hearts.
Which Jesus repeated
Mark 12:30:31 and Matthew 22:37 and Luke 10:27
30 Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your mind and with all your strength.' 31The second is this: 'Love your neighbor as yourself. 'There is no commandment greater than these."
That this concept was in the early Christian community is shown by Paul's letters.
Romans 2:14-2:16
14 (Indeed, when Gentiles, who do not have the law, do by nature things required by the law, they are a law for themselves, even though they do not have the law, 15 since they show that the requirements of the law are written on their hearts, their consciences also bearing witness, and their thoughts now accusing, now even defending them.) 16This will take place on the day when God will judge men's secrets through Jesus Christ, as my gospel declares.
Romans 2:28-29
28 A man is not a Jew if he is only one outwardly, nor is circumcision merely outward and physical. 29 No, a man is a Jew if he is one inwardly; and circumcision is circumcision of the heart, by the Spirit, not by the written code. Such a man's praise is not from men, but from God.
This new concept had to have been created by someone and that some one was a real person named Jesus. From this derives his concern about one's inner being as being more important than externally conforming to a set of laws.2 Corinthians 3:1-3:3
1 Are we beginning to commend ourselves again? Or do we need, like some people, letters of recommendation to you or from you? 2 You yourselves are our letter, written on our hearts, known and read by everybody. 3Y ou show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts.
Introduction
The victory songs, the "Song of Deborah"
in Judges 5:2 to 5:31 and the "Song of the Sea" in
Exodus 15:1 to 15:20, are the oldest passages in the Bible based on their ancient Hebrew style (similar to comparing old English
with modern English). Based on language style alone both must date to
before 1050 BC. Yet
the battle described in the Song of Deborah must date to before 1174 BC
when the tribe of Dan moved from the coast to conquer (or to occupy a
city already destroyed) an inland city which came to be called Dan. The
Song of Deborah also does not mention the Philistines indicating its
battle occurred before the Philistines emerged as a political entity.
In 1174 BC a group of landless people collectively known as the Sea Peoples attacked Egypt but were repulsed by Rameses III. The five ethnic groups mentioned in Rameses victory stele are the: Philistines, Sikels, Shekelish, Dananu, and Washashu. After this battle the Philistines conquered some Canaanite towns along the coast and settled there. They would be mentioned often in the Bible. The Sikels conquered the coastal city of Dor according to the memoirs of the Egyptian official Wen-Amon who was sent north to buy lumber between 1070 and 1044 BC. The Shekelish name has an intriguing similarity to the coin Shekel. As discussed below the Dananu probably became the Israelite tribe of Dan.
The translation used here is from the Judges volume of the Anchor Bible because of its attempt to keep the wording as close to the original as possible.
The other parts of the Song of Deborah can be found here.
Text
At Taanach by 's stream
Silver booty they did not take.
20 From the heavens fought the stars
From their courses they fought against Sisera!
21 The Wadi Quishon swept them away
The Wadi overwhelmed them - the Wadi Quishon
(You shall trample the throat of the mighty).
22 Then the horses' hoofs pounded
His stallions racing, racing!
23 "Oh, curse Meroz!" says the divine advisor.
"Utterly curse its inhabitants!"
for they did not come to Yahweh's aid
To Yahweh's aid, with knights.
24 Most blessed among women is Jael
The wife of Heber the Kenite
Among women in tents she's most blessed!
25 Water he asked
Milk she gave
In a lordly bowl
She brought cream.
26 With her left hand she reached for a tent peg
With her right hand for the workman's mallet
She pounded Sisera
She broke his head
She struck and pierced his neck!
27 At her feet he slumped. He fell. He sprawled.
At her feet he slumped. He fell.
At the place where he slumped, there he fell. Slain!
28 From the window she looked down and wailed
Sisera's mother, that is, from the lattice:
Why tarries
His chariot's arrival?
Why so late
The sound of his chariotry?
29 The wisest of her captain's ladies answers her
Indeed, she returns her own words to her:
30 Are they not looting
Dividing the spoil?
One or two girls
For each man.
Spoil of dyed cloth for Sisera
Spoil of dyed cloth, embroidered.
Two pieces of dyed embroidery
For the neck of the spoiler!
31 Thus may they perish, all enemies of Yahweh!
Let his lovers be like the sunburst in full strength!
Comment
At Taanach - Taanach is 4 miles from the large city of and is most likely the place where the Canaanites set up camp. From there they advanced through a 3 mile wide valley to attack the Israelite tribes which they thought were at the base of Mount Tabor 15 miles away hoping to kill them and reopen the trade route between Hazor and .
Stars - An ancient tradition considered
them to be the source of rain as they were holes in the firmament, the half shell that was the sky. God made the firmament, and it divided the
water below it from the water above it.
God called the firmament sky. (Genesis 1:7). Apparently a rain storm occurred during the battle.
Sisera - The commander of the opposing forces. His name is non-semitic suggesting that he is not a native of the area.
Wadi Quishon
- the wadi at the base of Mount. Tabor.
A wadi is like an arroyo of the American desert southwest which is normally dry yet susceptible to flash floods from rain storms in the mountains. A flash flood seems to have occurred here either catching some of the chariots as they were either escaping towards Megiddo or moving towards Mount Tabor. A branch of the wadi runs down the middle of the valley leading towards Mount Tabor. Wadis may have been the smoothest "roads" for the chariots or, since they were below the normal ground level, were used by the charioteers in an attempt to sneak up on the Israelites (although one would think the sounds and the dust raised would give away their position).
Meroz - Unknown place or people whose curse seems out of proportion if all they did was not send troops like some Israelite tribes. Possibly they were a nearby ally who did not respond according to some treaty.
divine
advisor - literally "mal'ak yhwh" (messenger of Yahweh). Messengers of God are also translated as angels.
Kenite - Hebrew "qeni", Originally a metal workering clan based on the root of its name "qyn" meaning "to forge" or "metal worker". Significantly the Hebrew word for Cain is also "qyn". Strangely, no Biblical ancestry is given for the Kenite clan leading some scholars to propose that Cain himself was considered their ancestor, the same Cain who was condemned to a nomadic existence as punishment for the murder of Abel (Genesis 4:8-12).
The first historical record of the Kenites is here in the Song of Deborah which locates them around the . Afterwards they are found in the Negeb, the most southern part of , with the Amalekites during the time of Saul (1 Samuel 15:5-6). Also 1 Samuel 27:10 refers to this area as "the Negeb of the Kenites". Significantly, the author of Judges also knew the Kenites belonged in the south for when he rewrote the Song of Deborah he stated in Judges 4:11 that Heber the Kenite had separated from the other Kenites. In any case the Kenites seem to have migrated south as stated in Judges 1:16.
References
The MacMillan Bible Atlas - 3rd edition, 1993
The Anchor Bible Judges by Robert C. Boling, Doubleday, 1964:
Anchor Bible Dictionary with David Noel Freedman as editor-in-chief, Doubleday, 1992.
In the words of the Anchor Bible editors, David Noel Freeman and the late William Foxwell Albright: "The Anchor Bible is a project of international and interfaith scope: Protestant, Catholic, and Jewish scholars from many countries contribute individual volumes. The project is not sponsored by any ecclesiastical organization and is not intended to reflect any particular theological doctrine. Prepared under our joint supervision, THE ANCHOR BIBLE is an effort to make available all the significant historical and linguistic knowledge which bears on the interpretation of the biblical record. THE ANCHOR BIBLE is aimed at the general reader with no special formal training in biblical studies; yet it is written with the most exacting standards of scholarship, reflecting the highest technical accomplishment."
Introduction
The victory songs, the "Song of Deborah"
in Judges 5:2 to 5:31 and the "Song of the Sea" in
Exodus 15:1 to 15:20, are the oldest passages in the Bible based on their ancient Hebrew style (similar to comparing old English
with modern English). Based on language style alone both must date to
before 1050 BC. Yet
the battle described in the Song of Deborah must date to before 1174 BC when the tribe of Dan moved from the coast to conquer (or to occupy a city already destroyed) an inland city which came to be called Dan. The Song of Deborah also does not mention the Philistines indicating its battle occurred before the Philistines emerged as a political entity.
In 1174 BC a group of landless people collectively known as the Sea Peoples attacked Egypt but were repulsed by Rameses III. The five ethnic groups mentioned in Rameses victory stele are the: Philistines, Sikels, Shekelish, Dananu, and Washashu. After this battle the Philistines conquered some Canaanite towns along the coast and settled there. They would be mentioned often in the Bible. The Sikels conquered the coastal city of Dor according to the memoirs of the Egyptian official Wen-Amon who was sent north to buy lumber between 1070 and 1044 BC. The Shekelish name has an intriguing similarity to the coin Shekel. As discussed below the Dananu probably became the Israelite tribe of Dan.
The translation used here is from the Judges volume of the Anchor Bible because of its attempt to keep the wording as close to the original as possible.
The other parts of the Song of Deborah can be found here.
Text
15 Issachar's captains were with Deborah
Issachar was Baraq's support
Dispatched to the plain, under his command
In Reuben's divisions are command-minded chieftains.
Why then did you squat between hearths
16 Harking to pastoral pipings?
To Reuben's divisions belong fainthearted chieftains!
17 Gilead bivouacked beyond .
Why did Dan take service on ships?
Ashur squatted at the seashore
He bivouacked
by his harbors!
18 Zebulun is a troop
That scorned death.
Naphtali too
On the heights of the plain!
19 The kings came and fought
Then fought the kings of Canaan:
Comment
Issachar - Hebrew "yissakar". The Hebrew root "skr" means "to hire" or "to pay wages". The tribe was originally located in the eastern hills around the fertile Jezreel valley and as such probably was the major antagonist of the city of Hazor.
the plain - the plain of Esdraelon.
Reuben -
Meaning "behold a son". The
tribe of Reuben was located around the northern end of the Dead (Salt) sea
before it was absorbed into the tribe of Gad and the non-Israelite state of
shortly before the time of King Saul.
Apparently Reuben did not send any of its fighters to this battle despite a reputation of being good fighters in the past.
Gilead - its Hebrew root "gld" means a "curly or difficult
surface".
was an early tribe located east of the whose
name continued to represent that area even after the tribe of
had merged into other tribes such as Gad and Machir. Even in Jeremiah's time the term
continued to be used to describe that area (Jeremiah 8:22).
Dan - this tribe eventually became the most northern tribe of Israel yet it originally was located by the sea as evidenced by the reference to the tribe having ships and from its inheritance list in Joshua 19:40-48 where it is located between what came to be Philistine land to its south and Sikel land (city of Dor) to its north. Archaeologist Yigael Yadin suggested in 1968 that the tribe of Dan was one of the Sea Peoples. Pharaoh Ramesses III records a tribe of Dannunna among the sea peoples who attacked in 1175 B.C. A tribe called Danaoi is recorded in the Greek Iliad.
The Danite inheritance come under Philistine control by 1150 B.C. Joshua 19:47 records:
"(But the Danites had difficulty taking possession of their territory, so they went up and attacked Leshem, took it, put it to the sword and occupied it. They settled in Leshem and named it Dan after their forefather.)"
Leshem is Laish
in Judges and its destruction around 1175 BC has been confirmed by archeology although whether the Danites themselves did it or it was done by others in the general movement of Sea Peoples around that time is impossible to tell. Judges 18:1 reports that after the death of Samson, who belonged to the tribe of Dan, that the tribe of Dan
"was seeking for itself an inheritance to dwell in". The blessing of
Jacob in Genesis 49 also suggests that Dan was not an original mountain tribe
of for
it says: "Dan shall judge his people as one of the tribes of Israel."
All this evidence suggests that the Dan was a tribe of Sea Peoples who had settled along the coast but because of attacks from other coastal tribes was forced to join the Israelite confederation and move into the hill country on the confederation's northern border.
take service - Hebrew "goor", a primitive root meaning "turn aside" as in turning aside from a road to stop, rest, or reside (from Strongs Hebrew dictionary). So this "take service" translation is a big stretch on purely literary grounds and it shows the bias of the translator who buys the idea that all Israelite tribes had to originally be desert nomads and one could not possibly be a Sea People. As such Dan as a whole tribe must have worked for some coastal city. Not ever explained by those who hold this idea is how a city in an economically depressed, trade stagnant, dark age could pay a tribe to work for them and how desert dwellers as a whole ever came to learn sailing methods.
Ashur - meaning "happy one". Ashur was located on the northern hilly coast between the cities of Tyre on the north and Mount Carmel range on the south according to the tribal inheritance list of Joshua 19:24-31. An Egyptian record
from the time of Seti I (1291 - 1272 B.C.) lists Ashur as a foreign land and
not as a tribal people suggesting that the tribe organized there and took its
name from the land. The land was well
suited for Olive orchards (Deut. 33:24). Unlike Dan's location the hills provided protection from armies with chariots.
Naphtali - a northern mountain tribe located around the eastern shore of the thus making them a neighbor of the tribe of Dan after Dan's migration. Notice that only 10 tribes are mentioned. The southern tribes of Judah and Simeon are not mentioned in the Song of Deborah.
References
The MacMillan Bible Atlas - 3rd edition, 1993
The Anchor Bible Judges by Robert C. Boling, Doubleday, 1964:
Anchor Bible Dictionary with David Noel Freedman as editor-in-chief, Doubleday, 1992.
In the words of the Anchor Bible editors, David Noel Freeman and the late William Foxwell Albright: "The Anchor Bible is a project of international and interfaith scope: Protestant, Catholic, and Jewish scholars from many countries contribute individual volumes. The project is not sponsored by any ecclesiastical organization and is not intended to reflect any particular theological doctrine. Prepared under our joint supervision, THE ANCHOR BIBLE is an effort to make available all the significant historical and linguistic knowledge which bears on the interpretation of the biblical record. THE ANCHOR BIBLE is aimed at the general reader with no special formal training in biblical studies; yet it is written with the most exacting standards of scholarship, reflecting the highest technical accomplishment."
.
Introduction
The victory songs, the "Song of Deborah"
in Judges 5:2 to 5:31 and the "Song of the Sea" in
Exodus 15:1 to 15:20, are the oldest passages in the Bible based on their ancient Hebrew style (similar to comparing old English
with modern English). Based on language style alone both must date to
before 1050 BC. Yet
the battle described in the Song of Deborah must date to before 1174 BC
when the tribe of Dan moved from the coast to conquer (or to occupy a
city already destroyed) an inland city which came to be called Dan. The
Song of Deborah also does not mention the Philistines indicating its
battle occurred before the Philistines emerged as a political entity.
In 1174 BC a group of landless people collectively known as the Sea Peoples attacked Egypt but were repulsed by Rameses III. The five ethnic groups mentioned in Rameses victory stele are the: Philistines, Sikels, Shekelish, Dananu, and Washashu. After this battle the Philistines conquered some Canaanite towns along the coast and settled there. They would be mentioned often in the Bible. The Sikels conquered the coastal city of Dor according to the memoirs of the Egyptian official Wen-Amon who was sent north to buy lumber between 1070 and 1044 BC. The Shekelish name has an intriguing similarity to the coin Shekel. As discussed below the Dananu probably became the Israelite tribe of Dan.
The translation used here is from the Judges volume of the Anchor Bible because of its attempt to keep the wording as close to the original as possible.
The other parts of the Song of Deborah can be found here.
EDIT: Introduction added June 9, 2007
Text
8 One chose new gods
Then they fought in the gates.
Neither shield nor spear was to be seen
Among the forty contingents in .
9 My heart is with the commanders of
Those presenting themselves with the troops
Bless Yahweh!
10 O riders of tawny she donkeys
O you who sit on the Judgement seat
O wayfarers on the road
11 Attend to the sound of cymbals
Between watering troughs
There let them retell Yahwah's victories
Victories by his own prowess in !
Then Yahweh's troops went down to the gates
12 Awake. Awake, Deborah
Awake. Awake. Sing a song!
Arise, Baraq
Take your prisoners
O ben Abinoam!
13 Then the survivor went down to the nobles.
Yahweh's troops went down against the knights for me!
14 Those of Ephraim who have taken root in Amaleq.
Behind them, Benjamin, with their troops.
From Machir, commanders came down.
From Zebulun,
bearers of the ruler's scepter.
Comment
new gods - perhaps referring to a desperate Canaanite city which chose new gods in an attempt to reverse their misfortune.
fought in the gates - most likely referring to civil strife and riots among the Canaanite city dwellers.
0 riders - this paragraph refers to merchants, tribal officials, and then all other travelers who gathered to hear stories told at the watering places. This is how the traditions of the Bible were passed on before they were written down.
nobles, knights - those adult male Canaanites wealthy enough to equip themselves for battle.
Ephraim - (meaning unknown) One of the two largest tribes of (Manasseh was the other) which was then living on land formally held by the Amalekites. The tribes of Ephraim and Manasseh would later merge to form the tribe of Joseph (the term "house of Joseph" first appears at the beginning of the divided monarchy). At the time of this battle Ephraim settlements were located along the eastern desert fringe, around the small valleys in the north central range just west of the desert fringe (especially around Shiloh), and on the plateau around the city of Bethel just south of the central range. Cereal cultivation and animal grazing were the main economic activities. Ephraimite Iron Age I (1200 to 900 B.C.) settlements number 110 with the 30 largest covering about 1.5 acres (each having a probable population of 150), another 30 are small villages covering between 1/2 and 1 acre, the rest are isolated farms. Joshua and Jeroboam (the first king of the northern kingdom) were Ephraimites.
Amaleq - the Amalekites were a nomadic people like the Israelites at this time and they proved to be 's most persistent enemy .
Benjamin - meaning "son of the right" or "son of the south". The tribe was located just south of Ephraim. Genesis 49:27 describes Benjamin as a "ravenous wolf, in the morning devouring its prey, and in the evening dividing its spoil". The tribe of Benjamin eventually became involved in a war with the other tribes of in which it was almost totally destroyed (Judges 19-21).
Machir - (from Hebrew root "mkr" meaning "bought") was the largest clan in the tribe of Manasseh. Genesis 50:23 has Machir being the son of Manasseh yet born on Joseph's knees signifying an almost semiautonomous status within the tribe of Joseph. Later Machir conquered the east of the from the Amorites and settled there (Numbers 32:39-40). Because of this, later tradition identified Machir as the father of (Numbers 26:29 & 36:1). The tribe of Manasseh is located north of Ephraim yet south of the Jezreel valley and its territory contains the earliest Iron age I (Israelite) settlements west of the . This corresponds to Genesis 48:13-20 where Manasseh is described as the older son yet Ephraim becomes the dominant son (tribe) by being blessed with 's right hand. The Manasseh settlements number 100 and surround the broad fertile valleys supporting the Canaanite towns. Compare the number of these Iron Age I settlements with the 12 in the .
Zebulon - a northern mountain tribe of located north of the Jezreel valley and west of the tribe of Issachar.
Introduction
The victory songs, the "Song of Deborah"
in Judges 5:2 to 5:31 and the "Song of the Sea" in
Exodus 15:1 to 15:20, are the oldest passages in the Bible based on their ancient Hebrew style (similar to comparing old English
with modern English). Based on language style alone both must date to
before 1050 BC. Yet
the battle described in the Song of Deborah must date to before 1174 BC
when the tribe of Dan moved from the coast to conquer (or to occupy a
city already destroyed) an inland city which came to be called Dan. The
Song of Deborah also does not mention the Philistines indicating its
battle occurred before the Philistines emerged as a political entity.
In 1174 BC a group of landless people collectively known as the Sea Peoples attacked Egypt but were repulsed by Rameses III. The five ethnic groups mentioned in Rameses victory stele are the: Philistines, Sikels, Shekelish, Dananu, and Washashu. After this battle the Philistines conquered some Canaanite towns along the coast and settled there. They would be mentioned often in the Bible. The Sikels conquered the coastal city of Dor according to the memoirs of the Egyptian official Wen-Amon who was sent north to buy lumber between 1070 and 1044 BC. The Shekelish name has an intriguing similarity to the coin Shekel. As discussed below the Dananu probably became the Israelite tribe of Dan.
The translation used here is from the Judges volume of the Anchor Bible because of its attempt to keep the wording as close to the original as possible.
The other parts of the Song of Deborah can be found here.
EDIT: Introduction changed on June 6, 2007
Historical Context of the Judges Period
This was the time of the Mediteranean's first dark age. The large city states of the Bronze age were declining as their specialized economies collapsed under the assult of moving tribes of people who cut off their trade. Only Egypt remained standing after beating off raids from the Sea Peoples. The new Iron Age civilizations that were emerging included Greek, Roman, and Isaelite.
Our first glimpse of the settled Israelites via archeology show them emerging as a group of hill people with a new technology of water storage, lime coated cisterns. They also had a unique style of house called the Four-Room House. Their cisterns allowed them to settle land that was not settled previously. To get along without fighting over scarce water resource they turned to respected members of the community called judges to resolve disputes. The common law that developed infused their culture with a respect for law that would greatly affect their developing relgion. Deborah was one such Judge and significantly she was a woman.
The "Song of Deborah" through verse 7
5.2 When they cast off restraint in
When the troops present themselves - bless Yahweh:
Hear, O kings
3 Listen, O princes
I to Yahweh
I, I will sing
I will chant to Yahweh
God of Israel
4 O Yahweh, when you came out from Seir
When you marched here from Edom's land:
The earth quaked
With thunder the skies rained
With thunder the clouds rained water!
5 The mountains shook
Before Yahweh, The One of Sinai
Before Yahweh, God of Israel
6 In the days of Shamgar the Anathite
In the days of Jael, they ceased:
The caravans and the wayfaring men
Who travel the winding roads.
7 The warriors grew plump
In they grew plump again:
Because you arose, O Deborah
Because you
arose, a mother in Israel
Comment
Deborah - Hebrew "debora" similar to "deborim" meaning bees.
Seir - meaning "hairy" probably refers to the wooded land leading down to the Araba plain from the Edomite plateau.
Edom - meaning "red" is the plateau with reddish soil south west of the . Thus this earliest tradition has the tribes of Yahweh entering from the east but it significantly does not mention Joshua.
Shamgar - "After Ehud came Shamgar son of Anath, who struck down 600 Philistines with an oxgoad. He to save Israel" (Judges 3:31). As these songs show the Philistines were not yet around. If this is the same Shamgar as is likely then later story telling about him drifted into having him fight the later Israelites most persistent rival, the Philistines. This Shamgar seems to be the one who ended the trading between the local Bronze age cities so he was one of the early Israelite's greatest battle leaders and because of that, one that would not have been forgotten.
Anathite - literally "ben anat" (son of Anath), Anath was an ancient near east goddess having an insolent, bloodthirsty, and warlike character who was the consort of the god Baal. The word "ben" does not necessarily indicate a biological son but also indicates "belonging to" as in "son of (the tribe) Judah" or "son of man". So Shamgar my be from the town of (house of Anath) mentioned in Judges as not being conquered. Alternately he was given his last name because of his violent nature.
Jael - the wife of Heber the Qenite who kills Sisera, the military commander of the king of Hazor.
Caravans - As a result of the Israelite settlement of the hill country the Israelites seem to have blocked or taxed the trade routes used by the northern Canaanite cities lead by the city of . This control of trade threatened the economic existence of the specialized urban civilization represented by these cities forcing them to send out troops to reopen the routes. This song is about such an attempt which was defeated by the Israelites when they trapped the city's warriors in a narrow valley.
grew plump - grew plump and prosperous from the trade route taxes or from the inactivity of peace. This controlling and taxing of trade routes was the primary activity that led to the strangulation of the Bronze Age city states.
References
The Anchor Bible Judges by Robert C. Boling, Doubleday, 1964:Anchor Bible Dictionary with David Noel Freedman as editor-in-chief, Doubleday, 1992.
In the words of the Anchor Bible editors, David Noel Freeman and the late William Foxwell Albright: "The Anchor Bible is a project of international and interfaith scope: Protestant, Catholic, and Jewish scholars from many countries contribute individual volumes. The project is not sponsored by any ecclesiastical organization and is not intended to reflect any particular theological doctrine. Prepared under our joint supervision, THE ANCHOR BIBLE is an effort to make available all the significant historical and linguistic knowledge which bears on the interpretation of the biblical record. THE ANCHOR BIBLE is aimed at the general reader with no special formal training in biblical studies; yet it is written with the most exacting standards of scholarship, reflecting the highest technical accomplishment."
The Historical Background
The times of John the Baptist and Jesus were times of economic disruption for the Jews as Israel was integrated into the Roman Empire. It was also a time of expectation that the Day of Judgment was near as implied by the prophecies in the Book of Daniel which I describe here. Further evidence for this great expectation was the appearance of several self-proclaimed prophets appearing shorty after the time of Jesus and John the Baptist who attempted to trigger the Day of Judgment themselves with disastrous results. Josephus in his book entitled Antiquities of the Jews reports these events. I quote a summary from the Anchor Bible Dictionary (Volume 3, page 891) here:
"In the first century there was an unnamed prophetic leader of the Samaritans who led a movement to restore the temple on Mt. Gerizim, a movement which was ruthlessly crushed by Pilate (Antiquities 18.4.1 pages 85 - 87). Around 45 C.E. Theudas led a movement to the Jordan River in apparent imitation of Exodus, but he and his followers were crushed by the Judean governor Fadus (Antiquities 20.5.1 pages 97 -98). Finally, about 65 C.E., a Jewish prophet from Egypt led a movement to capture Jerusalem by commanding the wall to fall down in apparent imitation of Joshua around Jericho. In this case the leader escaped but many of his followers were killed by governor Felix (Aniquities 20.8.6 pages 168-71, also in Josephus' Jewish War 2.13.5 pagaes 261 - 63).
What John the Baptist Taught Regarding the Coming Kingdom of God
According to Matthew John the Baptist was preaching against the the power elite in the form of the Pharasees and the Saducess warning them that they could not escape the coming destruction on the Day of Judgment just because they are Jews (Matthew 3:7 below). Instead everyone (according to Luke) must repent if they are to be saved. According to John the Baptist the Kingdom of God which would establish the reign of God on earth via the Jewish nation would arrive via an apocyliptic Day of Judgement.
Mark Chapter 1
1 The beginning of the gospel about Jesus Christ, the Son of God. 2It is written in Isaiah the prophet:
"I will send my messenger ahead of you,
who will prepare your way"
3 "a voice of one calling in the desert,
'Prepare the way for the Lord,
make straight paths for him.' "
4 And so John came, baptizing in the desert region and preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 5 The whole Judean countryside and all the people of Jerusalem went out to him. Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River. 6 John wore clothing made of camel's hair, with a leather belt around his waist, and he ate locusts and wild honey.
Matthew Chapter 3
1 In those days John the Baptist came, preaching in the Desert of Judea 2 and saying, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is near." 3 This is he who was spoken of through the prophet Isaiah:
"A voice of one calling in the desert,
'Prepare the way for the Lord,
make straight paths for him.' "
4 John's clothes were made of camel's hair, and he had a leather belt around his waist. His food was locusts and wild honey. 5 People went out to him from Jerusalem and all Judea and the whole region of the Jordan. 6 Confessing their sins, they were baptized by him in the Jordan River.
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.
Luke Chapter 3
3 He went into all the country around the Jordan, preaching a baptism of repentance for the forgiveness of sins. 4As is written in the book of the words of Isaiah the prophet:
"A voice of one calling in the desert,
'Prepare the way for the Lord,
make straight paths for him.
5 Every valley shall be filled in,
every mountain and hill made low.
The crooked roads shall become straight,
the rough ways smooth.
6 And all mankind will see God's salvation.' "
7 John said to the crowds coming out to be baptized by him, "You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. And do not begin to say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 9 The axe is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire."
Jesus was Baptised by John yet Jesus did Not Become a Disciple of John
Mark Chapter 1
9 At that time Jesus came from Nazareth in Galilee and was baptized by John in the Jordan. 10 As Jesus was coming up out of the water, he saw heaven being torn open and the Spirit descending on him like a dove. 11 And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."
12 At once the Spirit sent him out into the desert, 13 and he was in the desert forty days, being tempted by Satan. He was with the wild animals, and angels attended him.
Matthew Chapter 3
13 Then Jesus came from Galilee to the Jordan to be baptized by John. 14 But John tried to deter him, saying, "I need to be baptized by you, and do you come to me?"
15 Jesus replied, "Let it be so now; it is proper for us to do this to fulfill all righteousness." Then John consented.
16 As soon as Jesus was baptized, he went up out of the water. At that moment heaven was opened, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove and lighting on him. 17 And a voice from heaven said, "This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased."
Luke Chapter 3
21 When all the people were being baptized, Jesus was baptized too. And as he was praying, heaven was opened 22 and the Holy Spirit descended on him in bodily form like a dove. And a voice came from heaven: "You are my Son, whom I love; with you I am well pleased."
John the Baptist and Jesus Each Had Disciples with Differing Teachings
Mark Chapter 2
18 Now John's disciples and the Pharisees were fasting. Some people came and asked Jesus, "How is it that John's disciples and the disciples of the Pharisees are fasting, but yours are not?"
Mark Chapter 6
26 The king was greatly distressed, but because of his oaths and his dinner guests, he did not want to refuse her. 27 So he immediately sent an executioner with orders to bring John's head. The man went, beheaded John in the prison, 28and brought back his head on a platter. He presented it to the girl, and she gave it to her mother. 29 On hearing of this, John's disciples came and took his body and laid it in a tomb.
John Chapter 3
22 After this, Jesus and his disciples went out into the Judean countryside, where he spent some time with them, and baptized. 23 Now John also was baptizing at Aenon near Salim, because there was plenty of water, and people were constantly coming to be baptized. 24 (This was before John was put in prison.) 25 An argument developed between some of John's disciples and a certain Jew over the matter of ceremonial washing. 26 They came to John and said to him, "Rabbi, that man who was with you on the other side of the Jordan—the one you testified about—well, he is baptizing, and everyone is going to him."
John Chapter 4
1 The Pharisees heard that Jesus was gaining and baptizing more disciples than John, 2 although in fact it was not Jesus who baptized, but his disciples.
Conclusion
Despite being baptised by John the Baptist Jesus, in the end, did not completely agree with John's teaching. This resulted in each having their own set of disciples. By submitting to this baptism one can conclude that intially the teachings of John appealled to Jesus. Only after some time in the desert and civilization did Jesus break with John's teachings and form his own group of disciples.
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